Fender Princeton Reverb II;
  The valves (tubes)
last update May 2012; some extra advice under 'Mental Health Warning'

  See below for what the valves do and how the tone stack works, and here for how the footswitching circuitry works.


what the valves do
how the tone stack works
how the presence control works
users' experiences
PRII home
circuit diagram
Rebiasing the output valves/tubes

Good News
In case you hadn't noticed, the Princeton Reverb II uses three types of valve/tube and they're all widely available, both as famous old brands and good-quality present-day production.

Mental Health Warning

It's fun going in search of the perfect tone, but it can drive you bananas. The Bible says contentment is a good thing (1 Timothy 6v6) (6V6, geddit? I'm here all week....) and for our own sanity, surely there should come a point where we're happy with what we've got in the tone department? It seems ironic to me that, much of the time, we're jumping through all kinds of hoops to get the kind of tone which Hubert Sumlin or Elmore James got simply by picking up whatever they could buy/beg/steal/borrow, plugging in, and playing. And in a world where one billion (one thousand million) people have no clean water supply, are we really so desperate for that last 1% of tone improvement? Sermon over....!

That said, one of the satisfying things about all-valve amps is their comparitive simplicity. Only 5 stages of amplification and the tiny guitar signal is beefed up to potential pain level; and each of those stages is fairly easy to change. In modern solid-state amps, so many chips are used, each one containing hundreds of  transistors, the simplicity is lost, the sound must suffer, and experimentation is very difficult.

Read up a little on who makes valves these days. Despite there being many brand names out there, it usually boils down to three factories; one in China, one in Russia, and one in Slovakia. It's embarrassing to get excited about the possible differences between 2 brands and then discover the only difference is in the print job. You can pay more for more testing, and that may be a good thing, but don't forget, this only eliminates the ones you didn't buy - it doesn't improve the tone of the ones on sale.

I should probably add that, the more I discuss and read up on this, the more I get the impression that the speaker's more important. If your present valves are working OK, and not old and tired, then changing the speaker will have a far bigger impact on your tone. (Unless you know different; email me...)

Myths about Valves

(1) 7025s are special

No, they're not. They were originally devised as a low-noise 12AX7 (with coiled heaters to reduce hum), but in reality any reasonable-quality ECC83 or 12AX7 will work OK in the three places where 7025 is specified. My PRII is unbelievably low-noise with every 12AX7 I've tried.

(2) Don't touch the glass

You shouldn't touch them when they're hot because you'll be hurt! Duh! But these aren't halogen light bulbs, and the sweat from your fingers won't harm the valve. But don't shock them mechanically while they're hot. Frequent handling can rub the ink off, which might reduce the secondhand value of a famous-name valve. And try to hold power valves by the plastic base when fitting/removing from the amp, so reducing the risk of detaching the base from the glass.

(3) If you use low-gain preamp valves, the power valves have to work harder, which is a good thing

No. If you use low-gain preamp valves, you may or may not get a different tone, which you may or may not like. Then, to get the same audio volume as before, you'll have to turn the master volume knob up to a higher number on the dial. But if it's the same audio volume as before, then the power valves are doing exactly the same amount of work as before. If you want the power stage to work harder without an increase in audio volume, you'll have to use a less sensitive speaker or throw away some of the final output with a power attenuator.

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What the valves (tubes) do

Here's a brief description of what each of the valves (tubes) does. Starting from the input end (right- hand side as you look at the rear panel....)

V1 on Schematic - Input valve (7025 = ECC83 = 12AX7)
This one is close to the serial number plate. It's used as two separate stages of amplification in one glass bottle. One stage provides the first amplification after your weak little guitar signal arrives, almost exhausted, at the input jack. NB the amp's volume control comes after the first 'half' of this valve, not before, so it's not just a duplicate of your guitar's volume knob. The comes the bass, mid, and treble controls, and the volume knob; the other 'half' of this valve then provides another stage of amplification. How the tone stack works

Note that , when there's no jack plug in the front panel socket, the inputs of both halves of V1 are grounded by a switch in the jack socket. This cuts down on noise.

Obviously you want all the valves working well, but the signal passes through this valve twice, while it's still at a low level; so if this one's a bit noisy and tired, the others won't be able to help no matter how great they are. If you're minus a valve cover, don't let this valve go without, as in theory it's the most sensitive to interference.

Oct 2010 - I'm now using a 12AY7 in this position. On an arbitrary scale, 12AX7s are rated '100' for gain - 12AY7 are rated '40'. This cuts down the gain and ultimately the maximum volume you can get out of the amp, but (on my amp at least) it makes the clean sound much cleaner and takes away the feeling that there's still something a little unintentionally overdriven in there. This is not the same as simply turning down the front-end volume control, though I can't explain why! Using a lower gain valve here also cleans up the reverb a little. Anyway, 12AY7s are in current production by Electro-Harmonix and are widely available. I got mine from Voc Rock in Nottingham, UK - they keep some in stock even though they're not always shown on their website. It's not difficult to find NOS 12AY7s either.

V2 - Reverb Driver and 'lead' distortion (12AT7)

This valve is also a dual triode but the 2 little amplifiers are wired in parallel to create one preamp with enough current-capability to function properly. It has 2 jobs.
(1) It amplifies the signal considerably in order to wiggle the springs in the reverb unit. And it's doing it all the time, even when you haven't selected reverb - the 'reverb' knob comes after V3a (below). BUT
(2) irrespective of reverb setting, when you select the 'lead' effect, most of the (massive) signal from V2 is mixed into the sound via V3b, resulting in V3b being distorted (= "preamp distortion) and offering you a kind of valve overdrive sound.

Therefore the reverb depth drops to near-zero when 'lead' is also selected. This is a universal problem on the PRII and I know of no cure. Even if the reverb level could be kept up (maybe with some component value changes?), it would be a reverb of the clean sound only. Ideally the reverb would come after the distortion stage, so you could simulate "an overdriven amp in a big room", but without a redesign this amp will not do that. 

When in 'clean' mode (non-lead), the PRII has a reputation for useful reverb only from knob position 1-3; turn it up higher and all you get is more mush. If your PRII has the reverb tank mounted vertically, screwed to the side wall of the cabinet, put it in the base of the cab instead. The tank was designed to be horizontal and the reverb quality will improve bythis simple operation. But I found by accident that different 12AT7s can affect this, sometimes improving it. Maybe a lower-gain valve gives more useful adjustment; I know of one owner who has replaced this valve with a 12AU7 for this reason. But that will also affect the 'lead' sound. The amp will work without this valve - but minus reverb and lead (overdrive). I used to say on this web page that you needn't bother putting an expensive valve here. But I was wrong. In Feb 06; I put an old Mazda 12AT7 in here (with an old Mazda 12AX7 in V3) and the lead sound is much better. Then I put a used Brimar 12AT7 in V2 and the "lead" sound is now very usable. So don't let anyone tell you the "lead" effect is useless; you just have to be lucky with your valves. I buy used valves from eBay, sometimes without even a guarantee that they work. They cost one or two pounds each for Mazdas, Brimars and Mullards, and they nearly always work.

Some folks use a 12AX7 in this position. I would expect it to have a shorter life because it has a lower current capacity; but some claim they like the difference it makes to the reverb or lead sound.

To get a reverb which is based on a clean OR lead sound, and doesn't drop away when lead is selected, I can imagine an extensive redesign in which only half of V2, call it V2a, is used as the driver for the distorting V3b. The signal after V3b could then be picked off and sent back to the other half of V2, call it V2b, which would be the reverb driver.  The reverb output would then be mixed into the signal chain at a point after the place where it was picked off. There may be noise-considerations why this might is a bad idea. Also it halves the current drive to the reverb transformer; though that might be a good thing if it reduces mush and gives a wider range of control on the reverb knob. After all, some people use a 12AX7 in that position.

For the first year I had this amp, I thought the lead level knob changed the amount of distortion (like a gain control). This is not so. It's a volume control for the lead sound. There is no independent control over how much gain, depth, distortion you get, apart from where you set the volume knob, which affects your clean sound too. But the distort sound will be affected by your choice of V2; if you really want less aggressive distortion, ask your valve dealer for a low gain 12AT7, or a 12AU7. For more available distortion, get a higher gain valve. This will also change your reverb depth.

V3 - Reverb Pickup and final preamp (7025 = ECC83 = 12AX7)
(Nearest 'pedal red' socket.)  Like V1, this works in two 'halves'. The first 'half' picks up the signal from the reverb unit and passes it on via the reverb knob. The other 'half' provides another stage of gain for the main signal path through the amp. This second 'half' is the bit which is purposely pushed into distortion when you select 'lead', so swopping this valve will change the way that effect behaves. (Whether you like this kind of distortion (ie in the pre-amp), or prefer power amp distortion, is up to you; they are different.) I have an old Mazda 12AX7 in here and the lead sound is much better.

After V3 comes the master volume knob, the lead level knob, and the presence knob. NB the line/recording output comes after the output valves, not from here or anywhere in the preamp chain.


How the presence control works

There's a link from the secondary of the output transformer. it comes off the leg labelled 'grn' on the schematic and runs back over the top of the schematic, via a 100K resistor, to the inputs of v4. Below the inputs to v4 there's  potentiometer (the presence control) with a 0.1uF capacitor going down to ground. The link back from the output transformer is the Negative Feedback Loop or NFB. It feeds a small amount of final amp signal (loudspeaker signal) back into the earlier circuitry, but the feedback is out of phase - it's positive when the signal coming through the amp from v3 is negative, and vice versa. The result is some cancellation - a reduction in gain - and some reduction in distortion, because any errors introduced in v4, 5 and 6 are cancelled out a little.

(Some folks reduce the amount of NFB (eg, increase the 100K resistor) or get rid of it completely (cut the link at some point). The effect is to make the sound 'looser' with more distortion, more noise, more character and the possibility of the thing going unstable and starting to oscillate (hooting with no guitar connected). I have done this and it's fine simply with disconnecting that resistor.

The presence control is a tone control in the loop. Because it's a negative feedback loop, it has the opposite effect to what it should if it were located in a normal part of the schematic. Turn the presence up = reduce the potentiometer resistance = send more highs in the loop to ground = don't cancel out the nornal-signal highs heading for v4 = more highs in the final output, adding a bit of zing that might otherwise get lost.


V4 - Phase Inverter (7025 = ECC83 = 12AX7)
This one splits the signal so that both the signal and its mirror image are sent to the pair of power valves, so they can do their push/pull thang. I read somewhere that gain isn't a critical factor here. However some folks say you want a 'matched' valve/tube as your phase inverter if you want the maximum clean volume. This means the valve is matched with itself - there are 2 separate gain stages in a 12AX7; they are supposed to be identical but of course they usually aren't. Some suppliers will test for good matching of the 2 gain stages and sell the valve as 'matched' (at a higher price). This doesn't seem important to me, especially since the other components are 10% tolerance and not "matched", but I'd be pleased to hear from you if you've investigated it.

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V1-V4 do not need to be matched to each other in any way, and when you change them, no internal adjustments are needed. V1,3 and 4 (NOT V2, to be true to the original design*) may be interchanged with each other - the amp will work OK. If these valves come from different manufacturers/batches, the response, tone and noise levels will change as you swop'em around. Turn off the amp and allow to cool before changing them, though.

*Note May 05 - I should have added this bit some time ago, once I realised you can kind-of interchange 12AX7s and 12AT7s. There won't be any damage but the amp will behave very differently. You might like it; you might not. Basically the difference is the 12AX7 (used throughout the main signal path) has a higher gain but lower current capability. The 12AT7 was deliberately specified by the amp designer for the reverb driver because more current and less gain is needed at that point. So theoretically a 12AT7 in V1,3 or 4 will reduce the amp's overall volume capability in return for different tone. As already noted, a 12AX7 in V3 has an effect which some folks like, though I would expect it to die early because it's trying to supply too much current.

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V5 and V6 - Output or Power Stage (6V6GTA)
Bigger and fatter than the other valves, and lining up with the back panel where it says 'Princeton Reverb II'. They don't have covers, as they're barely susceptible to interference, and need all the ventilaton they can get. They work as a team to push and pull current through the output transformer, which in turn wiggles the loudspeaker. (At the risk of stating the obvious... the amp needs both of these valves to work; if one fails, you lose more than half of the power, with a truly horrible tone.) These 2 valves are best replaced as a matched pair; even then the amp needs checking, and maybe adjusting, as described in Rebiasing the output valves/tubes. Rebiasing isn't simply about nice tone, it's also about not destroying your new power valves.

These are specified as 6V6GTA. In practice you can use anything beginning 6V6 except those with metal casings. Metal-casing 6V6s have three problems; they're often microphonic (relaying mechanical vibrations as sound out of the speaker), they were designed with lower plate voltages in mind (so are more likely to fail) and they were sometimes constructed so that a high voltage might appear on the casing (so they're unsafe). Use only glass tubes, which what the GT stands for.) CV511 is an alternative name for 6V6GTY, which is what I'm currently using. GT, GTA, GTB, GTY... a little work on the web will show you what the difference is. GT's are rated about 15% less power than the others. In practice they're all fine so long as (a) you like the sound they make (b) the bias isn't adjusted so hot that they self destruct.

If the output valves aren't matched to each other, the amp will still work, but  in extreme mismatch cases (1) it's not as efficient (2) you might not be able to get a clean sound,  and (3) one valve will age faster than the other. But a small mismatch doesn't matter, in my opinion. I have bought unmatched pairs, tested them on a home-made bias probe, found them to be further apart than a matched pair should be, and yet run them with no audible problems at all.

In techno-speak, this amp has a pair of 6V6 valves (tubes) in a class AB output stage with fixed bias. The word 'fixed' here doesn't mean "you can't change anything" - it means you have to take steps to adjust them. The other type of amp design is called cathode-bias; that's self-regulating (bias doesn't need adjustment), but it's not used in the PRII. The combination of class AB and fixed bias gives the most power - in other words, you're probably not going to find a louder 2 x 6V6 amp.

I'm told V5 and V6 can be replaced with 6L6's (which are normally fitted to larger amps). You get more power but at a cost, a 4 ohm speaker is needed instead of 8 ohm, and the amp MUST be rebiased, no exceptions; see the modifications page for details.  

Try to hold  power valves by the plastic base (not the glass) when fitting/removing from the amp - it  reduces the risk of detaching the base from the glass.

I use a small clip-on fan (made from old computer parts) to run extra cooling air over the power valves. It can't make any difference to the temperature inside the valves - if it did, they wouldn't work properly! But it does reduce the amount of heat flowing into the rest of the amp. Most of the works live inside an unventilated metal box which is accidentally heated by the power valves, and that can't be good for them, so anything which blows heat away will be A Good Thing.

Finally...
There's the output transformer. The loudspeaker and the line out/recording socket both come off the output side of the output transformer.

... and that's it. On a really classic all-valve amp you'd have one more valve, i.e. the rectifier, but in this amp rectification is achieved by 4 silicon diodes. There are advantages and disadvantages with each.

PRII home


How the tone stack works

I am indebted to 'grkeith' on the Fender Discussion Page, who has allowed me to include his description of the PRII tone stack here. It will help to refer to the schematic as you go. He writes...

"There's a lot going on in that area of the circuit. They were obviously really trying to enhance the tone.

Like the common BF and SF Fender tone stack, the Treble control acts as a balance control for the highs and the lows. On the schemo I have, there is an error: the 100k should be shown connected to the plate of the tube and the 250pf. The signal is split there; the highs like to go through the 250pf to the 'upper' leg of the treb pot, the lows are resisted there due to that small 250p cap. The lows however more easily go thru the 100k slope resistor than the highs and divide up between .1 bass cap and .047 mid cap, and get drained off to ground according to the position of the bass and mid pot. The highs don't like to go through resistors as easily as lows, so they are attenuated slightly. If the mid and bass pots are set high, then more of the signal gets put on the 'lower' leg of the treb pot. Thus explaining the standard Fender tone stack and why the treb is a balance pot between highs and lows. So now, all the signal is coming out of the wiper of the treb pot, and sent to the vol pot via a network of caps and res, where more is happening that you don't normally see on a Fender tone stack.

The volume pot is center-tapped. When the volume is at half way, max highs through the 120p and 100p are sent direct to it, less if it's on either side of half way. signal is sent thru the 820k slightly attenuated in the highs again due to the resistor, and goes to the upper leg of the vol pot. The 820k resistor in series with vol pot also loses some volume at the top of the vol pot, and remember some of the highs are already held back in addition cuz of that 820k res.

Now you have another leg going thru the 500p and the 1m, the one meg is shorted out when the push switch on the treb is closed effectively putting the 500p direct to the top of the vol pot, so when the vol is dimed there is a direct line from the treb pot thru the 500p (the 500p holds back the lows from getting thru) to the top of the vol pot.

So there should be an apparent tone shift through the range of the vol pot.

There is a circuit to bypass the 250p treb cap which adds more mids.

That help?

(This message was last edited by grkeith at 06:18 PM, Mar 9th, 2007)"

grkeith, who wrote the above, has his own amp repair business in Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA.
You can see this circuit working (but not the pull-boosts) if you play with the component values in the 'Fender' section of this excellent free downloadable software.

One implication I hadn't thought of is that the entire signal of the amp passes through the treble control. So don't bang THAT knob on a door frame, eh?


Users' Experiences

NB I've listed this stuff from people I've 'met' on the internet because I think it's genuinely helpful, but your experiences may differ. Variations in component values from amp to amp, variations in valve/tube manufacture, variations in bias setting, and variations between your ears and mine all mean this is subjective.


Jan 2012 - ampman91510 on the FDP writes about putting a 12AT7 in v4 (the phase inverter) instead of the usual 12AX7...
"I didn't take a look at the schematic till after the amp arrived, and when I saw the long-tailed PI I went immediately to the stash of 12AT7's. I tried several, and the CV-4024 (that's an alternative number for 12AT7 - Andrew) seemed to sound very nice with this amp. It has a nice breakup, that's one of my most important things I listen for when experimenting with tubes, I like the amp right in the initial mild-breakup area, and if that sounds good then that's probably the tube I'll use. (I play a lot of southern rock, that kind of stuff, sometimes I'll dial up the preamp so it's just barely starting to break up when playing a very loud chord, and then raise the volume till the output stage starts crunching a little, that's just about the sweet spot for me). When the amp arrived it still had the original Fender-branded 7025 in it, and that sounded fine, it was more gainy and maybe a little darker sounding (it sounded nice though, kind of like an old RCA or something). And, it sounded more like a Princeton Reverb with that tube. With the 12AT7 in place, it sounds more Deluxe-ish, it definitely has the Deluxe vibe"
You can try this yourself simply by taking the valve out of v2 and putting it in v4 - you just lose the reverb and 'lead' sound when v2 is empty.

Oct 2010 - I've started using a 12AY7 (lower gain) as V1 and I'm loving the resulting cleaner, lower-gain sound. This is in effect a step back from the 1980s (when there was an assumption that most users would want a lot of gain) to the Fender-Tweedy days of the 1950s (when they assumed the opposite). As a side-effect, the reverb is cleaner too.

I've made myself a variable speaker attenuator ( a very crude imitation of a Weber MASS, or THD Hotplate, or similar). This allows me to use the sound of the power valves running at maximum power, but with the final volume being as quiet as I want. WOO HOO! The folks who write about this are right  - it opens up a new world of tone. Just to be clear, this is an extra box which connects between the amp's speaker output jack and the speaker. It dumps actual power - it's not just a 'volume box' which some folks put in their amp's effects loop, which only works at line level. (In any case the PRII hasn't got an effects loop...).

Because a speaker attenuator allows you to run the amp at high power, I wouldn't recommend it if you haven't added screen grid resistors (see the modi
fications page)

With a PRII and a speaker attenuator, there are 2 basic options.
(1) With the amp set for 'clean' (so you're not selecting the 'lead' sound). I have the volume (input gain) set at 9 or 10. Then turn the attenuator down to low volume and turn the amp master up to 8, 9 or 10. This gives an on-the-edge blues sound.
(2) For a more high-gain, squealing harmonics blues-rock sound, Select 'lead' . Turn the lead level up to 10, turn the attenuator to low volume, and use the volume control to adjust how much preamp gain/distortion you want. Even if you don't like the 'lead' sound, you'll probably like this because it has the 'buzz' removed, and warmth added, by the 6V6s running at near-max power.

At the time of writing I haven't experimented much with this because it's so much fun, I forget to play with the tone and boost controls. The mid-boost probably gives even more old-school blues tone. Obviously all this will be different with a different set of 6V6s and/or with a change to the bias setup.

If you only ever run the amp on '3' the power valves will probably last forever. A power attenuator allows you to wear out the power valves faster, because you can play at max power all day without hurting your ears; with the master or the lead level on '10' the amp is working to the max whether it sounds loud or not!   This makes a clip-on fan a really good idea. It won't save the power valves but it will stop the valves and transformers heating up the rest of the amp so much.

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I initially used Harma 12AX7s (v1,3,4) and a Harma 12AT7 (v2) from Watford Valves. They sounded fine and are currently kept for spares. For 6V6s, in my opinion Mazda is the best all-round - they have plenty of everything as a clean tone, and they distort beautifully. Brimar come a close second but are warmer and darker in some way. For everyday use,for about a year, believe it or not, I used the cheapest Russian ones from Maplin (an excellent UK chain of shops a little like Radio Shack). They're not even bought matched. (I made myself a bias probe which allows me to measure plate voltage and idling current without dismantling, so I can check this kind of thing very quickly). Cheap Russian 6V6s lack bass (so turn up the bass knob) and the high-volume distortion is a little brittle-sounding, but most of the time they're fine, and at £3 ($5) each (2003)  they were almost disposable. Then I discovered eBay and started buying used famous-name valves. My amp now has a mixture of Amperex, Mullard and Mazda preamp valves which cost less than £15 total, plus a pair of brown-base Brimar 6V6s (labelled CV511) which cost £10, and the result makes me want to play all day. I've probably bought about 20 used famous-name valves on eBay, only one of them has been a disappointment, all the others sound at least as good as mid-price new valves, and they're so cheap they're worth the risk so long as they're described as 'working'.

July 2006; people on the FDP seem to be raving either about new-production JJ 6V6s, or those from new-production Tung Sol. See the KCA and/or Watford Valves websites. Whatever, we should all be glad the world isn't about to run out of good-sounding 6V6s anytime soon. Reviews welcome!

Feb 08 - walking home from work, I saw an old radio in someone's skip (metal building-debris container). I asked if I could raid it for the valves and found two Mullard ECC83s, both of which turned out to work fine and sound sweet.

May 2010 - I've been using a pair of current-production Tung-Sol 6V6s for about a year now and they're very good - big bass, nice clear top end, fun distortion when pushed hard.

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Ed Victoria (CA, USA) has been kind enough to contribute....


I experiemented with NOS and new production, and of different types.  I finally arrived at a NOS RCA 5751 for the V1.  I like how it "rounded" out the tone and smoothed out some of the highs, at some expense of gain ...not as loud overall, but I gladly accept the tradeoff as the tone is better. In the V2, I went with a Mullard 12AT7.  Wow!  If the RCA 5751 was an improvement in V1, this made an enormous improvement for the OD tone.  When I got the amp and plugged in, I was very put off by the OD tone.  Which was ok as that was what I had read going in, and I was primarily looking for a "Fender clean" tone, and wanted a bit more headroom than a SF PrincRev (plus the fact that the PRII had a 12" spkr and slightly larger cab, but still smaller than a Deluxe Reverb).  Well after popping in the Mullard AT7, I was floored at how much it smoothed the OD's character, eliminating much of that hard graininess! The OD is now far more than just "useful" ; it now  rivals the clean channel in some respects.  I set the gain low for "clean" if want just a bit more girth and meatiness over the clean channel's chimey-ness.  Very nice!  And with the gain set just a bit higher, I get very nice blusey mild breakup. This tube really made the difference.

I also put Tung-sol (reissues) 12AX7s in the V3 and V4 ...not sure I could tell the diff between these and the orig RCA 7025.  But for 6V6s, I put in the Tung-Sol (again, the new production RIs) and these are VERY nice sounding tubes.  The bottom is more solid, the mids very clear and pronounced, and highs smooth and glassy.  What a balanced-sounding tube ...highly recommend these.

I did, BTW, go back and forth with the 12AT7 Mullard at V2 ...just to make sure I wasn't imagining things.  It did, indeed, make a significant difference and I am really pleased with the OD: less grain and more creamy...the way it should be :)

Also forgot to mention that I tried a NOS RCA 5751 in the V3 and didn't
care for it.  Somehow, it just didn't sound as as tight and focused for me, and the clean channel lost a bit more clean headroom --I was willing to accept a small loss of clean headroom from the 5751 in the V1 because it improved the overall tone, but in the V3, I got no tonal improvement for my trade.  For whatever reason, the reduced-gain 5751 in the V1 improved things, but the same tube in the V3 didn't sound better (...though it just occured to me NOW as I type this that I didn't try the 5751 in the V3 with the original 12AX7 in the V1 ; I only tried the 5751 in the V3 along WITH the 5751 in the V1 as well.  Oh well.  Since I am satisfied the way she sounds and behaves as it is now, I'm calling the tube "experiment" done....  since I did up the tubes, the Lead channel cleans up with the volume knob much better than it did with the orig tubes.


'Gitargeorge' on the FDP has been really cunning! He uses a 12DW7 as V2 because the two little amplifiers inside deliberately have two different gain-factors. He writes...
I have a PRII that I just got, changed the 47 ohm resistor (1/2w to 1w), added 470ohm 5w wirewound resistors for the screen grid, added a 15K resistor in parallel with the 10K resistor in the bias circuit, and changed the .0027 cap in the mid boost pull to .001, changed the tubes , V2 is a 12DW7 instead of a 12AT7. I also ditched the footswitch, the amps channels do sound out of balance when using the FS. So now I have almost the perfect Fender Amp , pull a switch and it gives me another slightly driven with more mids (supposedly MESA) tone, pull the mid boost and this amp screams.  <>The 12DW7 lowered the gain on the drive channel but made the reverb more intense because the low side of this tube is pins 1,2 & 3 and the high side is on the reverb driver. I experimented last night substituting different tubes in V2 & V3 and I ultimately decided that a 12AU7 in V2 and a 12AX7 (ECC82 & ECC83) worked the best.  I tried a 5751 in V2 & V3 which sounded good, and I have a few more combinations of 5751, 12AU7, 12AX7, and 12AT7 that I have yet to try, I'll keep you posted.... 

I tried different combos of lower gain tubes in V2 and V3 and found a winner. I also lowered the gain on V1.

V1 Sovtek 5751
V2 Tung Sol 12AY7
V3 5751
V4 12AX7

I decided to drop the value of V1 because I don't realy play that loud and I'm mic'ed mostly always. It's plenty loud, but I get the clear, crystal glassy Fender thing on the clean channel and if I select the lead by pulling the switch on the amp and also pulling the mid boost I get a nice break-up with lots of mids that will slice through any mix (Think Allman Bros.) with humbuckers, with a stratocaster (I have a Tokai that I absolutely love) the lead channel gives me an edgy, but pleasant blues tone I can surely live with. Now I'm ready to gig this amp. Like I said before I've been in the realm of EL84 class A Vox type amps and although they do what they do they don't come close to the clean tones that you can get from a Fender. The amp sounds phenominal with pedals. (Teese RMC2-Micro Vibe-69 Fuzz-Bad Monkey-Barber Direct Drive-Klon-Supa Trem- Boss DD3 Delay---Amp). It speaks with authority, I'm lovin this amp.

Thanks, George.


Dan Germann in Canada  writes "A few weeks ago i asked if you had any tube (oops,"valve")  recommendations. Well, i went ahead and bought the ElectroHarmonix. They seemed to earn a fair bit of praise, and they are priced right. (Also, i  have a few EH effects units that have given yeoman service for two decades.) For no reason other than consistency, i replaced all of 'em at once. There was not a big change in the sound, but there was a change. Since the original Fender valves were probably made by the same company (Sovtek) that's not a surprise. Besides, if i wanted a different sound i would have bought a different amp! My point is that to my ears, the switch to EH valves gave me the sound i have always loved, only more so. It sounds tighter and crunchier when i want it tight and crunchy, and  sweeter and smoother when i want it sweet and smooth."



If you'd like to add to this page please email me...
SPAMDEFEATaawaugh@btinternet.com

http://www.watfordvalves.com/testreports.htm contains a great roundup of 12AX7 and 6V6GTA reviews.

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Safety / Damage Disclaimer
Valve (tube) amps develop LETHAL VOLTAGES while running, and store them in charged components EVEN WHILE SWITCHED OFF AND DISCONNECTED FROM MAINS SUPPLY. These voltages are MUCH HIGHER than mains, and higher than anything you’ll find inside a transistorized amp. If this scares you, good. Inside a chassis, don’t use your fingers to touch anything which isn’t insulated or earthed (grounded). Don’t stick more than one hand in at a time, and keep the other hand well away. Use fine-nose pliers to manipulate components. Never, ever work inside a live amp while holding a connected guitar. If you’re not sure what you’re doing, get local help.

The details in this whole site are believed accurate but you act on them at your own risk. I have to disclaim any responsibility for injury, damage, loss of value or loss of gig due to inoperative equipment. Many of the web pages linked from this site say roughly the same thing, and  their content is of course not my responsibility.

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